MEMBERS of grooming gangs should not be considered Muslim due to the un-Islamic nature of their vile actions, a high profile member of the community has claimed.
In an impassioned Newsnight debate on the role of the Islamic community after the heinous incidents, one-panel member protested at blame being levelled at British Muslims.It follows a court hearing earlier this week which saw 17 men and one woman convicted of rape, sexual assault, human trafficking and inciting prostitution as the city of Newcastle was added to the growing list of UK towns blighted by the evil grooming gangs.
Muhbeen Hussain, founder of the group British Muslim Youth, claimed the sex gang incident was not a Muslim problem in an emotional speech which brought on criticism from controversial columnist Katie Hopkins.
Speaking on Newsnight Mr Hussain said: “Islam is a religion of all cultures.
Watch it yourself: http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b0917lrb/newsnight-10082017
A few from the past on Muhbeen: The MrBean Hussain & Chris Read Letters: Boys will be..?
Muhbeen Hussain tries to re-invent the past?
Muhbeen’s boycott of the Police – The unattractive side
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Rotherham Politics 
Of course it’s a “muslim probem” – the statistics show that to be a fact. The only common factor in these grooming gangs is their religious heritage – they come from Afghanistan, Turkey,Iraq,Iran,Syria, Albania, Pakistan,Bangladeshi – different nationalities , different cultures, same religion.
The reason that it is a “muslim problem” is because Islam preaches superiority – all muslims are superior and part of the global “ummah” , bound together by the cult following af the so-called prophet Mohammed.
There is of course a cultural element , especially with Pakistanis,even those born in the UK, who may live physically in Britain but whose mind is located in the villages of Kashmir, where honour killings, first cousin marriages, Biraderi loyalties, bribery and corruption are the norm, and where non-muslims are considered morally inferior – laughable as that superiority may seem to civilised people.
You know the expression – ” Just because a dog is born in a stable it doesn’t become a horse”.
Muslims in Britain are preached to in non-English languages, preferably Arabic, but certainly in Urdu, by Imams imported from abroad who follow the Maududi philosophy or preach in moques and Islamic Centres funded by Saudis, indoctrinating their congregation with the rigid fundamentalist Salifi doctine of Wahab.
There are many many issues, and the problem will never be solved with the political classes that we have in office, because the main issue is the total cultural mismatch between western civilised democratic lifestyles and 7th Century Islamic religious and social practices which belong in the desert.
No government will ever face the real problem, be it a halt to Saudi money used to export fundamentalist Wahabbi beliefs, rejecting multiculturalism policies,, promoting British nationalism and western values as superior ……………….. what chance do you think there is of this happening ? I won’t be holding my breath.
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I suspect that Mr Hussein is in a teensy-weensy bit of denial mode (I have had to go on the same journey, honestly asking why Christians do some horrible things and why there are some horrible things in the Bible). But his comments raise two possible creative avenues: (1) an opportunity, finally, to debate what Islam is in essence. And when we do that we may find some uncomfortable things in the Quran in the same way Christianity has had to come to terms with uncomfortable things in the Bible – and matured because Biblical revelation is by it’s nature progressive. The latter things supercede the former. Time for Islam to mature too? But this raises the question whether these uncomfortable things are essentially Islamic? Or can they be safely jettisoned and maintain an Islamic core? Difficult because the Quran is an all-in-one revelation. You have to take it as a whole. So can Muslims let go of those Quranic things, such as the mysogyny and polemical (sometimes violent) attitudes to non believers and effectively still be Muslims? In other words, can you actually be a Muslim and live in a tolerant western liberal culture? I think they can if they simply practice the 5 pillars and let go of things such as Sharia which conflicts with British common law at so many points eg. This is a tolerant postion to Islam. I have noticed from my historical studies that Islam only seems to “function” in a society when it is dominant. ( it spreads mainly through military and political control but when it is a minority faith it struggles to assimilate). More importantly we may discover what is NOT in the Quran, notably a clearly articulated call to a transformed life, and in that sense Islam is not comparable to Christianity, and not even to humanism. I would happily have Quranic studies made compulsory for all British 16 year olds. It would settle the debate in no time as it’s ethical difficulties and blank areas become clearly apparent. (2) Hussain’s comments raises the intriguing potential for the moderate Muslim community to come right out and operate some forceful and clear excommunication strategy on these cse perpetrators. If they are unislamic it is time to act so and think so and keep saying so (herein is the difference between “evil Christians” and “evil Muslims”. The Christians clearly disown and repudiate and discipline their straying sheep). Such a strategy will not change their behaviour per se but it will put clear water between them and their “host” community. Unfortunately, I see very little appetite for this. (e.g. recently invited to Sarah Champion hosted metting for faith leaders to discuss strategy to tackle cse. 16 attendees made up of 14 church leaders and only 2 Muslims, both young charity leaders, but not a single Imam) Why? I think it brings us back to the uncomfortable issues raised in doing (1). Problems lead to scrutiny and accountability. Scrutiny and accountability lead to difficult questions… But al, of us have to live in that framework and we should all be here to help each other through the dialogue.
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Islam is not “reformable”. It is not a pick-and-mix.
It is completely defined by the contents of the Quran
To reject the Quran as not being the word of Allah spoken through Mohammed is to reject Islam.
Fundamentalists don’t believe in context, so all the Hadiths are irrelevant, but whether Sunni or Shia, the Quran is sacrasanct, and from it’s contents follows all the conflicts with Western values.
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I fear you may be right Paul – but the challenge to reform needs to be put out there if only (a) to put the issues in proper relief and (b) if only for the enlightenment of the political establishment who cannot see the impossible contradiction in their policy of attempting to assimilate that which cannot be assimilated to western democracy. Also (c) to challenge thinking muslims about what kind of society their belief system will take us to. If they ask the question, can I be a Muslim in a western democracy? they are then faced with a stark existential choice (i) subvert the society (which is what is largely happening) or the untinkable (ii) forsake Islam
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Or, even more simple, move to an Islamic country where there would be no assimilation problems !
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The political establishment created the multicultural society ( despite every poll of the public showing that the population wants immigration stopped for the past 30 years ).
They only socialise and mix with middle-class educated muslims, who either don’t really practice, or who know how to play the two-faced taqiyya trick.
It is the political establishment who have welcomed Saudi money and their fifth column clerics into this country.
So what if they now realise that multiculturalism is a failed experiment ? What can they do ? Mass deportations ? They have created a monster that they don’t have the will to slaughter.
The pro-multicultural lobby has been indoctrinating people for the past 40 years through the media, education, race relations laws and employment contracts. It is so ingrained in the social and economic fabric of British society that vested interests cannot admit to the error of , as you say, ” attempting to assimilate that which cannot be assimilated to western democracy “.
It is much easier to persecute those who dissent from the multicultural dogma than to admit the mistake that they have themselves made. They have following this policy for years to suppress free speech, using the police to arrest dissenters on nonsense Public Order offences whilst allowing violent left-wing demonstrators.
The problem is soluble – it will take harsh government policies and a change of tack to pu Islam in its place and to educate those who have been indoctrinated by this cult with the truth. I cannot see any politician who will grasp this nettle – it is easier to duck and weave than to front-up to the problem.
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“This is a tolerant postion to Islam. I have noticed from my historical studies that Islam only seems to “function” in a society when it is dominant.
Given the rapid population growth which doubles every 12 years, the youthful demographic profile, the demonstrably strong cohesion of the communities which makes itself felt through bloc political organisation, the propensity of some to use the most extreme self sacrificing violence, the gang culture which is dominating prisons for instance, the woeful appeasement of our so called political elite, and the money power of re-cycled petrol dollars – that over time it will become precisely that, dominant?
Excellent thought provoking posts by yourself and Paul Wilson,
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And putting the telescope to his blind eye Admiral Nelson said “I see no ships”…
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“A high profile member of the community” ?? Who fed the writer that garbage ??? Pathetic little weasel would be more accurate ! Assimilation of Islam into a Western democracy can simply not happen – the ultimate oxymoron of the 21 Century
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I fear that for our civilisation to survive this threat we must go through some dreadful strife and we must be brave and not led by appeasing cowards.
We will be thrown into a new dark age if we fail and scientific and economic progress will reverse!
Life may be a living nightmare for dozens of generations and all because our leaders spent decades refusing to recognise the obvious and sought to gag those who did.
A robbing, murdering, raping and enslaving paedophile sat in a remote place, dictated a book a very long time ago and it’s contents may not be discussed or challenged, what a load of tosh! Time is coming when it must be or to submit to superstition and tyranny.
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An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.
Winston Churchill
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Nice quote
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Tolerance and apathy are the last virtues of a dying society.
Aristotle
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Back on topic……
FORMER equal rights chief Trevor Phillips launched an attack on the politically correct by failing to accept paeophile gangs are being formed by Muslim men.
He accused the BBC of trying to “avoid being accused of stigmatising a community” by failing to address the perpetrators in high profile cases in Newcastle and Rotherham were Muslims who would have “claimed to be practising”.
Instead, the BBC this week branded 18 people convicted of grooming and raping girls as young as 13-years-old in Newcastle an “Asian” gang.
This was an “evasion” of the truth, Mr Phillips said, adding it was time for people to accept “these men are not just dark-skinned perverts”.
“What the perpetrators have in common is their proclaimed faith. They are Muslims, and many of them would claim to be practising”
Trevor Phillps is a man worth listening to, unlike Muhbeen Hussain who, like his extended family is in denial.
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Colin, actually we are on topic here. Muhbeen’s comments are all about what being a true follower of Islam means so we have to ask what is Islam? What social impact is it having? Can we go on thinking that religion and politics do not mix? When a person’s faith has a direct bearing on how they relate to their fellow citizens and how they shape society then religious questions become political questions. Sorry, there is no way to seperate them. But it can be positive – eg the Christian activists of the 1820-40s who transformed a corrupt and divided society for the better… See Simon Heffer’s “High Minds” – where are such people today? They are needed.
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Colin;
“Trevor Phillps is a man worth listening to” Ouch!
I don’t think I’m alone in thinking that that statement deserves an “IMHO”!
I can fully explain why if needed, but in short -. as chairman of the Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC) his record was considered abysmal by members of the other individual Equality Commissions that were brought in under that umbrella.
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rev:
‘MEMBERS of grooming gangs should not be considered Muslim’
It is a disingenuous statement and is designed IMV to deflect criticism from the vile crimes against young people committed by Muslims.
Three key aspects of Islam make it different and more dangerous than other religions: Sharia, Jihad, and Muhammad.
Wherever Sharia is embraced by an Islamic nation, oppression of women, religious minorities, gays, atheists, and ex-Muslims follows. Cruel and unusual punishments are employed and fear is used to control the population. The European Court of Human Rights ruled Sharia “incompatible with the fundamental principles of democracy.”
While Jihad can mean to struggle to improve oneself, Jihad meaning ‘violent struggle’ is prevalent in the Quran, Hadith, Islamic history, and modern day Islam. One need only turn on the evening news to see Jihad in action. Since no other religion has the doctrine of Jihad, we should expect more Muslims to succumb to violence then followers of other faiths. That is exactly what is happening. What would truly be baffling and in need of an explanation is if Muslims weren’t turning to violent Jihad.
Like other military leaders of his day, Muhammad committed many ruthless acts. Islamic biographers reveal that he warred with neighboring tribes, ordered assassinations, killed prisoners of war, exploited women and children, gave his blessing to violent religious Jihad, and made people slaves. Many Muslims are only taught Muhammad’s merciful deeds and still remain shockingly ignorant or in denial of his complete life history. If Muhammad had preached non-violence, to love non-Muslims, or to live in peace, then we’d have tens of thousands of Muslims around the world acting like Jesus. Because Muhammad was the antithesis of Jesus, we have tens of thousands of Muslims acting like warriors. This makes Islam, and Muhammad, much more dangerous than other religions.
All those convicted of CSE see and treat women as second class persons and young white girls as trash. I haven’t seen or heard of any Hindu’s or Sikh’s being charged with CSE.
The problem with turning the other cheek is you end up unconscious.
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Colin I agree with you – even a cursory examination of Islam throws up huge problems for a civil society. And turning the other cheek is a personal proscription, in no way to be applied to civil law. Imho the Christian response to this issue is about making sure the victims and the vulnerable get justice and protection from these evil monsters.
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Fair comment
“There is a chilling similarity between the Newcastle Islamic Rape Gang cases and the Rotherham scandal and that is the relatively small population of Muslims who seem to be committing an awful lot of sex crime. In Rotherham the population of Muslims was about 6% but they still managed to clock up many hundreds of victims to their name. Both the Rotherham and the Newcastle cases show, in stark and horrible detail, that it doesn’t take a very large population of Muslim men to be present in a town or a city, in order for large scale sexual predation of non-Muslim women and children to start to occur.”
http://www.fahrenheit211.net/
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What percentage of Rotherham muslims were involved in sex crimes?
4 Hussain brothers from 1 family committed numerous sex crimes. Do they represent the muslim population of Rotherham? Were they elected to represent the muslim community?
Does Jimmy Savile represent the white population or Christians. His victims numbered several hundred.
Were these monsters from the Rotherham Pakistani muslim community committing their crimes because of their religion?
or
was their real reason theses monsters were getting away with their crimes as the Police, Council officials and others turned a blind eye?
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There are around 4000 Muslim men in Rotherham, operation Stovewood last estimated the number of suspects at being around 1200 (although not obviously not all will be from Rotherham).
In a previous trial, a victim claimed 90 of the men who had raped her as a child were from Rotherham.
An appalling proportion on Rotherham’s male Muslim population ate apparently involved in the systematic gang rape of British children.
Jammy Saville did indeed molest a lot of children though…so…
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Sarah Champion’s come out on the issue
“However, as the latest case in Newcastle proves, we must accept that for gang-related child sexual exploitation, the convictions have largely been against British Pakistani men.
The Government must act now to understand why this is.
We have a large group of men behind bars, let’s do some research and find out why these monsters think it is acceptable to abuse children in this way.
Unless we know why they do, we can’t prevent it”
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/4218648/british-pakistani-men-raping-exploiting-white-girls/
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Come on sba …..it was said that the four Hussain brothers were the ring leaders …conservatively (it was said) 1400 victims of sexual abuse ..”IMHO” (for reg readers benefeit) there must have been a hell of a lot more abusers than said four …and again IMHO and prof Jays were all men of mainly Pakistani heritage which were muslims…….Also sick of hearing the jimmy Savile comparison.
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I did not say there were only 4 abusers. My point was these 4 from the family committed numerous crimes as came out during their trails. of course there are alot more abusers than these 4.
In regard to Jimmy Saville his victims number hundreds but he crimes are not used to tranish the community he came from nor he represents them?
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For the record these monsters should rot in jail for the rest of their lives!
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Why give Muhbeen this oxygen of publicity in the media?
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‘Why give Muhbeen this oxygen of publicity in the media?’
Because the BBC’s Newsnight programme editor is another fantasist lefty who believes in a ‘diverse and multicultural’ range of views that excludes anyone who is not left of centre and does not agree that Muslims are persecuted in the MSM.
I cannot think of another national broadcaster who would give Muhbeen the opportunity to spout falsehoods and spurious ‘facts’.
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Unreconstructed Guardianista
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Katz
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This inveterate self-publicist will do/say anything in the pursuit of our money, but this time he seems to have upset his co-religionists the most, oh dear!
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I’m suprised that you haven’t picked up on Sarah Champion’s comments above
“However, as the latest case in Newcastle proves, we must accept that for gang-related child sexual exploitation, the convictions have largely been against British Pakistani men.”
And very interestingly Corbyn has backed her
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/video-news/video-jeremy-corbyn-stands-up-for-his-mp-on-grooming-backlash-36022679.html
There’s obviously a division opened up here between Labour leftist “progressives” and Muslims – and what is perhaps a silent majority of Labour MP’s who have taken on board the reactions of their traditional supporters and maybe the outrage expressed on social media.
Champion was very brave to say this in the wake of Newcastle, she’s apparently the second Labour MP to do so in 15 years, the first being Ann Cryer of course
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If you have Sky, go to the religious channels and go listen to all the Muslim channels. They squabble constantly about interpretations of an ancient text.
It reminds me of two things:
The religious squabbles before and during the English Civil War,
And, The Life of Brian!
I cannot tell if this is a symptom of a dynamic or a dying culture.
Which ever it is, we must protect ourselves from crimes and violence.
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